The War on Terror is not a Religious War”
He is ranked amongst the greatest cricketers in the game’s history but today the man I knew as an introverted, shy, bookworm (when he was not being chased by an avalanche of adoring women), is bringing the same intense commitment and integrity to his twin passions- philanthropy and politics. (The Shaukat Khanum hospital he built in Lahore to honor his late mother and to serve the poor stricken with cancer for free is a state of the art facility that competes with the best in the world. He is also building a second hospital now in Karachi and a college for the underprivileged).
Pakistan goes to vote on 18th February, after the elections were postponed due to Benazir Bhutto’s tragic assassination. Imran Khan shares his thoughts on what he thinks will happen, why he has boycotted the elections, and why Pakistan does not need foreign interference in its domestic affairs by America
With all the violence that has been happening in Pakistan after Benazir Bhutto’s assassination, your house arrest last year and fears of some more violence as the elections near, how are you handling your security?
The Interior Ministry has issued a Press statement that all political leaders should look after their own security and that in itself says everything. But in my case I guess I’m less of a threat than Benazir was because Benazir had vocally supported the American war on terror and the NATO forces staying in Afghanistan, and being allowed to come in the tribal areas. Then she had endorsed the worst ever butchery which was the slaughter of women and children in Lal Masjid by Musharraf and she was the only political leader who supported it.
Then there was her going against the peace deal in Waziristan. She was so hawkish and pro American on this war on terror that not only would she have been at threat from all these forces fighting the US, but also the pro-Musharraf (group)-whether it was Musharraf or the politicians supporting him-they were also threatened by her. So it could have been either the extreme forces or it could have been the forces threatened by Benazir who would have then palmed it off (her assassination) on the extreme forces. So she was under threat from two quarters.
In my case, the only threat I have is from Musharraf and of course his ally Altaf Hussain, the leader of the MQM whose case I have taken to Britain and Scotland Yard. The Canadian Supreme Court has declared it (MQM) a terrorist organization. So my threat will be from these two people-Musharraf and Altaf. In that case they are directly implicated. They can’t palm it off on extremists as far as I’m concerned. So I guess as far as I’m concerned, I’m less at threat than Benazir was.
I have been hearing that your integrity and commitment are impeccable and you are very loved and admired by the younger generation. They are very disappointed (and 60 percent of Pakistan’s population is under 40) that you were in a better position to stand this time and yet have boycotted the election. The older generation respects you as much but feels an uncompromising idealist like you won’t last very long in the cut throat and devious world of South Asian politics.
Well Jinnah was an idealist in the sense that he was quite uncompromising in his objective. He is the only role model I have because he had complete integrity.
This was the best prepared we were to fight elections. In the first election in 1997, our party was only 5 months old so actually in no position to fight elections. It was also a mid-term election. In the second election we were supporting Musharraf. We were conned by his fake sincerity, till we realized he was a con man, that he was just a dictator trying to grab power so we left Musharraf. We were neither a government party nor an opposition party. We left just 3 months before the elections-the only party to leave him who was invited to join him. Every party that was invited-joined him. So as we were neither government nor opposition we fell between the two stools.
This is the only time we have a rising vote bank, we have good candidates who would have fought in a viable coalition. But my party is called Tehreek-e-Insaf-(movement for justice)-and eleven years ago we had said that unless the judiciary is independent there can be no democracy or prosperity. Now for the first time in history the judges have taken a stand for the constitution rather than the doctrine necessary and played ball with the establishment. This is the first time they stood up for the rule of law and now for me to abandon the judges and fight elections just because we had a good chance would have gone against everything I stand for. So there was no question of me fighting elections.
But your friends and well wishers have talked to me and said that getting some judges reinstated isn’t going to solve Pakistan’s problems. They go beyond the issue of the lost judges.
Look it’s the worst of times and it is also the best of times for only one reason-that for the first time we have judges who are willing to stand up for the rule of law. That is the only light at the end of the tunnel because when people say you can’t solve Pakistan’s problems, I respond that you can only solve problems if the foundation is a solid one and that foundation has to be based on an independent justice system, because that is the beginning of both democracy and prosperity. What happens is that when you have rule of law, it enables you to have free and fair elections and genuine democracy. It is also what allows the entrepreneurs and the businessmen in the community to have a level playing field.
The war on terror can also only be won if there is a genuine, democratic, credible government which can talk to the people and isolate the terrorists. A fourth problem we have is of the federation right now. There is civil war going on in two provinces, so for that you need genuine democracy with an independent Supreme Court and provincial autonomy to actually deal with it. All our problems can be resolved by a genuine democracy and an independent justice system.
Many of the Pakistanis I have spoken with tell me, America and other European powers have no real knowledge of the local and regional politics of Pakistan and therefore the US continues to make decisions that are making the Pakistanis very angry. The fact that the administration still backs Musharraf is not going down well with most Pakistanis. Last month you were part of a protest in the UK when Musharraf came to meet the Prime Minister there and you were also in Washington DC to talk to members of Bush’s administration. How did that go?
There is a lot of ignorance and they basically don’t understand the dynamics of Pakistani politics. They are only looking at it from a “liberal vs. extreme” viewpoint. That is all they can see-which is a stupid way of looking at any country because every country has its liberal and its extremists but the majority are always moderate. They seem to be ignoring the vast majority of the population. All they seem to be thinking of is liberals vs. extreme. And some of our politicians and Musharraf play this game. Musharraf tells the US look help me otherwise the extremists will take over.
This nonsense distorts the way the Americans look at us. They don’t have a deep understanding of what is going on. My whole objective was to make them understand –do not back any person whether it is Musharraf or Benazir-don’t do it-just back the democratic process because only a credible democratic government can deal with the problem of extremism. Only they can mobilize the people to marginalize the extremists. You have to mobilize the public, win their hearts and minds, so that the extremists get marginalized. The way the war on terror is being fought is that basically they are pushing more and more people towards extremism.
So what we are asking them is to leave us alone. But if you want to help, help the democratic process, ask for the reinstatement of the judges. Now that was what my message was but unfortunately the administration led predictably by George W Bush and what else would you expect of them-are backing Musharraf still and alienating the people of Pakistan. I told them anti-American sentiment is rising in Pakistan, because you are repeating what you did in Iran when you backed the Shah against the people of Iran.
You said in an interview that when the military begins to see someone as a liability they dispose the person off. Has Musharraf reached that state with the Pakistani military? Some experts are saying even the current chief Kayani’s pulling out army top brass from civilian posts is a gimmick to win the people’s confidence as per Musharraf’s instructions.
The Army from the past experiences eventually will go to protect the institution. Musharraf has become a liability, an increasing liability for them. What happens on the 18th onwards is very important because if he rigs the elections, there is going to be a massive discontent and you will see protests in Pakistan similar to Kenya. If he doesn’t rig the elections then he is gone because there will be a deadlock in the Assembly and unless PPP bails him out again, it will be all over for him.
Again he may try to get out of the elections-then again he is in trouble because it is not an answer. The problems in Pakistan are increasing by the day and he himself has become a problem. There is no way the Army will keep standing by him, especially since now he is no longer the Army Chief. All the previous three dictators were removed by the Army, so its only a matter of time.
I guess the other issue is the war on terror and Islam being considered the perpetrator of violence. It seems to be really ingrained in the minds of global leaders.
And the whole war on terror is not a religious war. It is a political war. The origins lie in politics. Look, the same tactics are used by the Tamil tigers in Srilanka. Do you ever call them Hindu extremists? Do you find cures in Hinduism to cure suicide bombings of the Tamils? It is absolute nonsense and a very well planned conspiracy to build an enemy like the communists and like the Nazis- to Islamo-fascists. You build an ideological enemy and then you rally your people behind you and put the fear of God in them like they did with the communists and then you can just push your imperialist policies through. This is a new con strategy. How can you blame the religion when all religions basically say the same thing? How many religions are fostering extremism and which are not?
You have the Hindu extremists and they burnt down 14 churches in Orissa and you have BNP in England who are extremists who want all other races to leave, who are focused on the color of your skin. You have the greatest fanatics in Israel. Every human community has its extremists, fundamentalists, its moderates and liberals. Why blame a religion for the activity of a few fanatics?
The New York Times did a survey 2 years ago of 67 madrasas (Muslim schools) and the worst terrorist attacks. Only four were from Madrasas. 51 percent were university graduates. So that is another myth that the Madrasas are breeding terrorists. Are the Srilankan suicide bombers coming out of religious seminaries? Suicide bombing has nothing to do with religion. Its an act of desperate people who out of impotence and humiliation and desperation turn to violence. It has happened in history. If you study the root cause of all terrorism, it is political not religious. Look at the Palestinian and Israeli issue- its political; US troops in Iraq and Afghanistan? Political again. Take Osama Bin Laden who is supposed to be this big Islamic extremist. All 3 reasons he cites for fighting US are political. Its nonsense to blame religion for terrorism.
A lot of tongues are wagging about the outcome of a possible coalition between PPP and Nawaz Sharif’s party if the elections are held. Many have said-well, anything to bring back democracy; others have called it a lethal combination that may explode later. Many from both the older and the younger generation feel neither will be able to solve the issues facing Pakistan. And then there is Musharraf and the King party.
What you are seeing in Pakistan is a divide-status quo and the anti-status quo. I represent the anti-status quo which is the APDM. APDM is a coalition of 25 parties, admittedly smaller parties but they are very ideologically oriented. Then you have the civil society and the lawyers also standing behind the judiciary. There is also a religious party the Jamat-e-Islami –it is also with us.
Now on the other hand, the parties that are contesting the elections-I’m afraid are from the status-quo. They don’t really want change. They don’t want an independent justice system. None of the politicians who are fighting the elections are interested in an independent judiciary or change because this is the system that has benefited them. This is the system they can play with, this is the system where their corruption is protected by the judiciary so they cannot afford independent judges. They are scared of them. So you are seeing this big divide and I’m afraid this is the tussle in the coming months. The PPP has saved Musharraf three times. Whenever he was on the rope each time PPP came to his aid.
These are not elections. This is fraud being conducted in the name of elections. I ask them –how can you have elections when the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court is under house arrest. Sixty percent of the judges are gone. The care taker government is not neutral. The whole administrative system was bought out by Musharraf to rig the elections and then the election commission is not independent. The whole administration is working for the King’s party. To fight elections you would be playing on Musharraf’s wicket and re-strengthening him.
There is no doubt we are facing multi-crises but if these crises had not occurred the status quo would still be strong and if that continues then there is doom ahead. We can’t survive with the status quo in this country because its just corrupt ruling elite, a parasite, sponging the people dry. These elitist-I call them “leeches”-they are hogging all the resources and just not letting the country move forward.
These crises have shaken the status quo with this movement of the lawyers and judges and the civil society. Now that is the bright light. It is at cross roads-if we manage to get rid of these people, if the movement succeeds and the reinstatement of the judges happens then you will be seeing a new Pakistan, a new beginning. If we fail then I’m afraid we have bad times ahead.
Acknowledgement: Special thanks to Babar Khan and Saifullah Niazi for arranging this interview.